Improviz

Our dear friend and King of the Trolls M&M hath spaken: he's claiming that he will be "getting some runs in" this Sunday. Since on previous occasions he's said that these runs are occuring at Wesbank Raceway, I assume he meant there, but I'm sure he could verify that for you.

Recall that he claimed to have run a 13.7 @ 165Km/h (102.53 mph); he later changed his tune and posted a timeslip showing a 13.735 @ 162.16. Myself and others are doubtful about this claim unless he had a very, very stiff tailwind; M&M states that this track is at 5,750 ft., where this speed and trap speed would altitude-correct to 12.794 @ 108.75mph.

He claims that his E46 M3 is "bone stock", running 12.7's ON STOCK REAR TIRES, which would be either Continentals or Pilot Sports, of size 255/40R-18 or 255/35R-19. Of course, they'd also be mounted on stock M3 rims....

Now, given that on one prior occasion he first promised to be there, then later ducked out and gave a lame excuse, and for several other reasons, myself and other members of this forum have called his credibility into question, and have concluded that it is basically zero.

However, here's a shot at redemption, well, OK, partial redemption, given that his trolling and lying have pretty much mortally wounded it, and a single run ain't gonna change that!! Still, if he can do it, I'd love to see it: any of you SA AMGers care to show up and bear witness to M&M's incredible driving skills?? Videos of his stock tires would be great as well.

Any takers??? Myself and others are anxiously awaiting your reply!!

M&M

I'm so touched you thought to point this out. Actually I will be going to Tarlton raceway, not Wesbank. But I way go there as well If I have time. All the locals know where Tarlton is so be there if you want. I will be going with the following buddies:

- RS6 (chipped)
- S4
- S3
- 2 x E36M3
- 2 X Subaru Wrx STi (one of them PPP)
- C55 (hasn't confirmed)

Bring a camera. If you get this in time we are meeting at the Hillfox Power centre at 7:00.

BTW, Improviz, I didn't change my tune about my times. I have had many 13,7 runs. I have all the slips, say the word & I scan them.

Improviz

And btw, what is the altitude of Tarlton?

Also, at which track did you run in the video? And what was its altitude?

Finally, I love how the video doesn't show the C55's launch. Any reason for this? Edit him out, or lousy camera work?

M&M

Check the video for editing. There are no missing frames. Anyway, what difference doesn the launch make, its an auto, you stomp it? You saw the time. We actually ran 5 times.

Tarlton is about 5500ft I think. Don't go calling me a liar if I'm wrong. I'll look it up.

Bilal

Improviz, come on man, making so any links is cruel, just leave the guy alone. Its getting very personal now and I'm sure I'm not the only one who thinks your consistent offensive comments make MB owners look bad. So what if his claims are false, does it really matter? Youv'e taken it upon yourself to make him look completely idiotic, thats not fair. This is a car forum not a **** message board.

Get over it...

Improviz

I asked you if your car is stock, with stock tires. True?

No, you don't "just stomp it" in a car with 245-series tires and 390 lb-ft of torque. If you do, one of two things will happen, depending upon whether or not traction control is enabled:

If it is enabled, it will brake the spinning rear wheel(s) and cut power to the engine--which costs time.

If it is disabled, the wheels will break loose, the car will spin all through first gear, and prematurely shift into second--which costs time.

The proper way to launch is surface-dependent. Left foot on brake, right foot on throttle between 750-2000 rpm (the latter requires a *VERY* sticky launch surface), release brake to get weight transfer, and then a "rapid squeeze" of the throttle to full. Done properly, this will get just enough spin to prevent bog, but not enough to adversely affect times.

For your reading pleasure, here is a pertinant quote from Car & Driver's first test of the 349 horsepower, 391 lb-ft of torque E55 in 1999: Note that this car wore 275/35-18's on the back. Shave 30mm a side off of that and 150 pounds or so, and imagine what the result would be in a C55 with 245/35's on the back. Spin, baby, spin!

M&M

OK fair enough.

My car is no longer stock. At the time of those runs it was stock with stock tyres (You can see the rims in the video). I did not have the OE tyres (so I guess you gonna' say it wasn't stock), but I had Toyo T1-S.

Improviz

I'm merely trying to point out inconsistencies. I mean, come on: the guy is coming in here making claims not supported by any evidence; I'm simply pointing it out, along with his, um, "exxaggerattions" as the president would say.

This is not solely because of the car being discussed, either: I would be equally skeptical, actually more so given the higher difficulty of launching, if someone claimed a 1.7 second 60' run in a stock CLK55. Throw some 275s or 285s on the back and/or drag radials, and it sounds more plausible, but not on stock tires. The compound simply isn't soft enough for that low of a 60' time, and these cars don't have a low enough weight/horsepower ratio to overcome it and make it up.

As to my making him look idiotic: hey, if he'd stop posting those "exxaggerations", it wouldn't be so easy!!

cntlaw

readers here need to read the thread to find out the background of Improviz, M&M and THAI 's debate
previous thread

M&M

Well we went but it wasn't good. It rained on & off the whole time. Track was damp & greasy, humidity was very high & baromteric pressure was very low. All cars were slow. My buddy with the RS6 that normally runs 12's was doing mid 13's. I have a video of him giving me a good beating.

I ran a best of 14.08 @ 101mph, but the track was so slippery that I had to lift in the 1-2 shift to avoid hitting the wall. I raced the S4 n the wet 4 times & his best was 15.0. I won every race against him by a substantial margin even though the trach was wet & he has quattro. He's a good sport though, I'd be sacred to race a powerful rear-driver in the wet for fear of getting side-swipped.

BTW, track is almost 6000ft above sea-level.











Here's a video of me getting whooped by my friend's RS6:

http://members.roadfly.org/eurom3/M3vsRS61.avi

Jon200

nice pics M&M

great vid of you against the RS6, it looked very close from behind.

I am more interested in your runs against the S4 as it is suppose to be a closer competitor to the M3 than the RS6.

M&M

Yeah I have quite a few vids of me vs S4. Problem is I wanted higher quality so we used the DV tape instead of the memory card on the camera. SO we need to transfer from tape & host. Can only do it tomorrow. The S4 & I have raced many times before & I thought that the wet track would swing things in his favour .... BTW we raced 5 times & the last race it was raining quite steadily. The results was the same for all 5 races.

Thai

Sshhh...improv does not know it yet...but he's as much an outsider on this forum as M&M...and me, i guess. He's just too arrogant to realize that....

M&M has proven himself to be a respectable troll...he does back up his track times (from what i can see).

Improv...your foot still in your mouth??

Oh wait, i know...you will now respond to my post by making EVEN MORE LINKS in your posts against me!! You're the laughing stock of this forum...and you don't even know it!

This is too funny...oh, don't forget to mention your amazing custom home, 3 cars, and engineering major (wow...sarcastically!) in your posts! :p

BTW, i am still waiting for your thesis on off-roading...my PM box is still empty.

Improviz

What modifications have you done to it?

What size and type of tires is it currently wearing?

Times you're getting aren't really surprising for modded...and of course do nothing to prove your claim of bone stock M3's hitting 1.7-1.8 second 60' times.

M&M

OK Improviz, I can't prove an M3 can do those times. Its just my hunch from many years of racing. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm right. I'm chilled. I enjoy racing & do it for fun. You win some, you lose some. I lost to 4 cars today. But either way I shake the guys hand afterwards & inevitably we all have a beer later.

I have a chip now & my Toyo's are 265/35 18". I guess technically that's not standard size.

Improviz

Which is that when you had the chance to pony up and show what your M3 could do against an AMG, you wimped out and didn't show . I think that people can quite clearly see through your rants and what's behind them; you're angry that I pointed out that you would talk the talk but wouldn't walk the walk and show up to put your money where your mouth was. Thus began your desperate little jihad, wherein you began trying to divert attention by attacking me, my cars, my home, my career....everything but the central fact, which you cannot change.

So, keep attacking and looking childish...it's actually quite amusing, albeit sad, to watch. Guess the exposure of your chickenhood really got under your skin, eh??

Thai

Hahaha, i knew it! Three links in one post...impressive! I don't care if you put 10 links...you're embarrassing yourself!! Just open your eyes...not many people (if any) are supporting you!

BTW to all the newcomers, just read the last few pages of the many links posted above...you will get the idea....

OPEN YOUR EYES, Improv...you're losing respect from this forum's members with every dumba$$ post.

Improviz

You are right: I do keep posting links, just so people can see who exactly is the odd man out here. Let's see how many people love Thai and his trolling here, shall we? And this is all just from one thread:

IdriveFast obviously supports you, here:

and here:

and here:

MrAMG *really* supports you here:

As does user oggle, here:

and here:

FrankW supported you here:

and here:

and here:

and finally noted (as I have) that you simply are arguing for the sake of arguing, and bailed out here:

neoprufrok supports you here:

and here:

and comes to the same conclusion as FrankW and myself here:

and reiterates it here:

cntlaw supports you here:

Again, all that from *one* thread, and I stopped looking halfway through....yeah, pretty easy to see how much support you've got here, lol!

Thai

Hmmm, when was the last time a M-troll got any support on an AMG forum??? I am a troll...i admit it! Same goes for an AMG troll on a M-forum. What was your point again??

You're different...you're defending this forum, yet no one on this forum likes you nor respect your opinions.

I pity your sorry a$$.

oggle

Thai, you're an idiot. Improviz owned you fair and square. You're the one that's "losing respect from this forum's members with every dumba$$ post".

Thai

Well, i was wrong, Improv...you have a b!tch afterall.

Improviz

M&M

Impro-the link man-viz, I know you ain't getting any at home & that's why you carry on the way you do. But its cool, I ain't getting any either. That's what being married is all about. I think the last time I got action, George Michael was straight

But here's a few more vids if the bandwidth holds up:

http://www.geocities.com/eurom3/S4vsM3.avi

http://www.geocities.com/eurom3/S4_1.avi

http://www.geocities.com/eurom3/ScoobievsS3.avi

http://www.geocities.com/eurom3/M3vsRS62.avi

Jon200

S4 weights a fair bit and without a proper launch, the AWD can't be that much of an advantage over RWD I heard

anyway, it has one more horse than the M3, heavier and AWD (means more power loss in a drag) so I expect the M3 to come out on top at the end of the 1/4

M&M

Yeah here's some vids in damp conditions at nearly 6000ft elevation. Watch the back end get nasty on the 1-2 shift:

http://b6s4.com/host/m3vss4_2s.avi

And here against a buddy's E36 M3 (euro spec 321hp):

http://b6s4.com/host/s4vse36m3.avi