Got the larger heat exchanger installed last night! ~ Pics ~ News
08-01-2007, 04:43 PM
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Got the larger heat exchanger installed last night! ~ Pics ~ News
Well, I finally got around to installing the larger heat exchanger. This thing is a beast. It measures 30x8x3. The stock unit is pathetic when placed next to the new HE. It is designed to bolt into the stock HE location. This is the largest size HE you could fit into the bumper. It bolts to the underside of the bumper, and is more secure than the stock unit was. It has a drain built into it, which is a nice touch. The only modifications needed to make this unit work was to trim the front underside body panel right below the engine about 2 inches across, and reroute the windsheild washer line to above the bumper instead of below. Both of these took me minutes to do. It connects right up to the stock hose locations. Also, fluid capacity increased by 50oz. Overall, the job was a piece of cake to do. Bumper removal, drain coolant system, remove old he, install new one, add coolant, bleed air bubbles out, and put the bumper back on. If you need to replace the IC pump, thats the time to do it as well as its right in the open, and infinitely easier to access with the bumper off.
Initial impressions are awesome. The water temps are the same, so the radiator is still receiving plenty of air. Butt dyno says the cooler air is translating to more power. Car feels just as peppy at the begining and end of a 30 minute spirited driving session
I will do some testing with my autoenginuity software for definitive results. But I have no doubt this is going to be an incredible mod, as it was on my Cobra.
GREAT NEWS!!!
For those of you that are looking to upgrade the heat exchanger, there will finally be one available on the market. I have been working for a few weeks with an HE manufacturer who is starting production this week on a new bolt-in HE or the C32 that will be offered through a sponsor. It is modeled after the one on my car, except it will look a bit nicer, and have a better inlet and outlet. I am receiving one next week for approval, and we will move forward if everything looks good. So withing a few weeks, everyone will be able to join in the fun. Modified or stock, this is one upgrade everyone can use. When I have some updates, I will post them.
On to the pictures.
Initial impressions are awesome. The water temps are the same, so the radiator is still receiving plenty of air. Butt dyno says the cooler air is translating to more power. Car feels just as peppy at the begining and end of a 30 minute spirited driving session
I will do some testing with my autoenginuity software for definitive results. But I have no doubt this is going to be an incredible mod, as it was on my Cobra.GREAT NEWS!!!
For those of you that are looking to upgrade the heat exchanger, there will finally be one available on the market. I have been working for a few weeks with an HE manufacturer who is starting production this week on a new bolt-in HE or the C32 that will be offered through a sponsor. It is modeled after the one on my car, except it will look a bit nicer, and have a better inlet and outlet. I am receiving one next week for approval, and we will move forward if everything looks good. So withing a few weeks, everyone will be able to join in the fun. Modified or stock, this is one upgrade everyone can use. When I have some updates, I will post them.
On to the pictures.
08-01-2007, 04:57 PM
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I don't have a C32 but I'm always a huge supporter of those who make things happen and come up with new things... Job well done!! 
08-01-2007, 05:42 PM
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Impressive stuff. Well done. Can't wait to hear the specs.
PS: Is there any way to generate objective data? You'd need to observe incoming and outgoing fluid temps over a range of operating modes, comparing OEM to the new unit. Sorry to sound like the skeptic; but I assure you that this data will sell a LOT more units.
PPS: When changing the intercooler pump, is there any need to bleed the system? I'm sure it's not difficult, but I have no idea how to do it.
PS: Is there any way to generate objective data? You'd need to observe incoming and outgoing fluid temps over a range of operating modes, comparing OEM to the new unit. Sorry to sound like the skeptic; but I assure you that this data will sell a LOT more units.
PPS: When changing the intercooler pump, is there any need to bleed the system? I'm sure it's not difficult, but I have no idea how to do it.
Last edited by Fifth Ring; 08-01-2007 at 05:44 PM.
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08-01-2007, 06:11 PM
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awsome!!
I bet your price point will be much cheaper than extravagant prices the well known tuners want.
what kinda of IC pump are you running?
I bet with the johnson pump and this core, it will be the end of heat issues with the C32.
C32 heat issues are not as bad as the E55.
I bet your price point will be much cheaper than extravagant prices the well known tuners want.
what kinda of IC pump are you running?
I bet with the johnson pump and this core, it will be the end of heat issues with the C32.
C32 heat issues are not as bad as the E55.
08-01-2007, 09:53 PM
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Fabricate one for me, would you please?!
There is something about safely increasing DD and sanctioned event horsepower that appeals to my sensibilities.
I have already been given the green light by the accounting department. Please let us know when they become available.
There is something about safely increasing DD and sanctioned event horsepower that appeals to my sensibilities.
I have already been given the green light by the accounting department. Please let us know when they become available.
08-02-2007, 12:24 PM
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Ok everyone, let me answer some more questions and give you an update.
Weight - I did not weigh them. But when the new unit comes in from the manufacturer, I will weigh it for sure. I can tell you from carrying the two at the same time that the larger unit does not weigh more than the stock unit. In fact, it was deceivingly light considering its size.
Pump - I have the Cobra pump. I still believe the stock pump is perfectly suitable. If I was upgrading the size of all the IC lines, then I would consider a larger pump. But I just dont think its necessary.
Fluid capacity - I got the rest of the air out of the system. The capacity increased another 20oz, bringing the total fluid capacity increase to 70oz. To put it in perspective, that is a little over 1/2 gallon (.54). That is very helpful in our quest for cooler temps.
Data - There will be data available on the efficiency of the larger HE. To be honest though, its an upgrade that speaks for itself. This is a common upgrade for supercharged or turbocharged cars (larger IC for turbo).
Price -This has not been determined yet. This is one of many projects I am currently developing for the C32. My goal is to bring great quality parts at reasonable prices to the MB world. The market for the C32 is shifting tremendously. More people are modding now that warranties are expiring, and miles are going up. This car has incredible potential, especially considering the current state of the C32 value. I was disgusted with the C32 aftermarket prices when I first bought the car. From the moment I realized the market was shifting, I was determined to develop parts that everyone could afford.
Availability - Soon, very soon. I should have the first unit next week for approval. Once everything looks good, they will get the green light. Lets just say they will still be here in time to combat some of the summer heat
Weight - I did not weigh them. But when the new unit comes in from the manufacturer, I will weigh it for sure. I can tell you from carrying the two at the same time that the larger unit does not weigh more than the stock unit. In fact, it was deceivingly light considering its size.
Pump - I have the Cobra pump. I still believe the stock pump is perfectly suitable. If I was upgrading the size of all the IC lines, then I would consider a larger pump. But I just dont think its necessary.
Fluid capacity - I got the rest of the air out of the system. The capacity increased another 20oz, bringing the total fluid capacity increase to 70oz. To put it in perspective, that is a little over 1/2 gallon (.54). That is very helpful in our quest for cooler temps.
Data - There will be data available on the efficiency of the larger HE. To be honest though, its an upgrade that speaks for itself. This is a common upgrade for supercharged or turbocharged cars (larger IC for turbo).
Price -This has not been determined yet. This is one of many projects I am currently developing for the C32. My goal is to bring great quality parts at reasonable prices to the MB world. The market for the C32 is shifting tremendously. More people are modding now that warranties are expiring, and miles are going up. This car has incredible potential, especially considering the current state of the C32 value. I was disgusted with the C32 aftermarket prices when I first bought the car. From the moment I realized the market was shifting, I was determined to develop parts that everyone could afford.
Availability - Soon, very soon. I should have the first unit next week for approval. Once everything looks good, they will get the green light. Lets just say they will still be here in time to combat some of the summer heat
08-02-2007, 12:59 PM
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Ok everyone, let me answer some more questions and give you an update.
Weight - I did not weigh them. But when the new unit comes in from the manufacturer, I will weigh it for sure. I can tell you from carrying the two at the same time that the larger unit does not weigh more than the stock unit. In fact, it was deceivingly light considering its size.
Pump - I have the Cobra pump. I still believe the stock pump is perfectly suitable. If I was upgrading the size of all the IC lines, then I would consider a larger pump. But I just dont think its necessary.
Fluid capacity - I got the rest of the air out of the system. The capacity increased another 20oz, bringing the total fluid capacity increase to 70oz. To put it in perspective, that is a little over 1/2 gallon (.54). That is very helpful in our quest for cooler temps.
Data - There will be data available on the efficiency of the larger HE. To be honest though, its an upgrade that speaks for itself. This is a common upgrade for supercharged or turbocharged cars (larger IC for turbo).
Price -This has not been determined yet. This is one of many projects I am currently developing for the C32. My goal is to bring great quality parts at reasonable prices to the MB world. The market for the C32 is shifting tremendously. More people are modding now that warranties are expiring, and miles are going up. This car has incredible potential, especially considering the current state of the C32 value. I was disgusted with the C32 aftermarket prices when I first bought the car. From the moment I realized the market was shifting, I was determined to develop parts that everyone could afford.
Availability - Soon, very soon. I should have the first unit next week for approval. Once everything looks good, they will get the green light. Lets just say they will still be here in time to combat some of the summer heat
Weight - I did not weigh them. But when the new unit comes in from the manufacturer, I will weigh it for sure. I can tell you from carrying the two at the same time that the larger unit does not weigh more than the stock unit. In fact, it was deceivingly light considering its size.
Pump - I have the Cobra pump. I still believe the stock pump is perfectly suitable. If I was upgrading the size of all the IC lines, then I would consider a larger pump. But I just dont think its necessary.
Fluid capacity - I got the rest of the air out of the system. The capacity increased another 20oz, bringing the total fluid capacity increase to 70oz. To put it in perspective, that is a little over 1/2 gallon (.54). That is very helpful in our quest for cooler temps.
Data - There will be data available on the efficiency of the larger HE. To be honest though, its an upgrade that speaks for itself. This is a common upgrade for supercharged or turbocharged cars (larger IC for turbo).
Price -This has not been determined yet. This is one of many projects I am currently developing for the C32. My goal is to bring great quality parts at reasonable prices to the MB world. The market for the C32 is shifting tremendously. More people are modding now that warranties are expiring, and miles are going up. This car has incredible potential, especially considering the current state of the C32 value. I was disgusted with the C32 aftermarket prices when I first bought the car. From the moment I realized the market was shifting, I was determined to develop parts that everyone could afford.
Availability - Soon, very soon. I should have the first unit next week for approval. Once everything looks good, they will get the green light. Lets just say they will still be here in time to combat some of the summer heat
08-02-2007, 02:12 PM
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Some more news. After talking with the manufacturer again, we are going to make one modification for better fit. The lower inlet in the HE pictured on my car is about 1 inch lower than the pump outlet. Although the hose fits, its not perfect. To combat this, we are not going to split the core down the middle, but one inch higher. So the upper part of the core, that is hidden behind the bumper will be 3", and lower will be 5". This will give us room to let the pump outlet and the HE inlet, line up perfectly. Plus, there will be another inch of height that is more exposed to the opening in the bumper.
Also brought to my attention was the possibiblity of making the HE shorter so that there would be no trimming involved, or isues of hitting the HE while driving. We decided that losing 28 square inches of surface area is far worse than taking a few minutes to trim the panel. With the larger HE, you would need to be more conscious of driving your lowered vehicle, as there is no movement, and it completely fills the bumper. But this is a risk that anyone takes with a lowered vehicle and larger HE or IC.
Also brought to my attention was the possibiblity of making the HE shorter so that there would be no trimming involved, or isues of hitting the HE while driving. We decided that losing 28 square inches of surface area is far worse than taking a few minutes to trim the panel. With the larger HE, you would need to be more conscious of driving your lowered vehicle, as there is no movement, and it completely fills the bumper. But this is a risk that anyone takes with a lowered vehicle and larger HE or IC.
Last edited by Code3 Performance; 08-02-2007 at 02:14 PM.
08-02-2007, 02:21 PM
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Seriously, if you want to generate some sales (for you or a buyer of your product) then you will help yourself a LOT with some data.
PS: A little free intellectual property law advice. Treat this design as proprietary and YOUR property. Mark your blueprints/plans with "Confidential" and "Copyright 2007 - Joe Blow, all rights reserve." This may allow you to sell out the design to a tuner rather than selling the tuner ONE HE and having the tuner copy it.
08-02-2007, 02:52 PM
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Woot, that and a K&N Filter!!!
Seriously, if you want to generate some sales (for you or a buyer of your product) then you will help yourself a LOT with some data.
PS: A little free intellectual property law advice. Treat this design as proprietary and YOUR property. Mark your blueprints/plans with "Confidential" and "Copyright 2007 - Joe Blow, all rights reserve." This may allow you to sell out the design to a tuner rather than selling the tuner ONE HE and having the tuner copy it.
Seriously, if you want to generate some sales (for you or a buyer of your product) then you will help yourself a LOT with some data.
PS: A little free intellectual property law advice. Treat this design as proprietary and YOUR property. Mark your blueprints/plans with "Confidential" and "Copyright 2007 - Joe Blow, all rights reserve." This may allow you to sell out the design to a tuner rather than selling the tuner ONE HE and having the tuner copy it.
The stock unit is a tube and fin design with plastic end tanks. The prototype is tube and fin as well. But the production unit will be bar and plate. Tube and fin intercoolers are light and good at exchanging heat, they don't have as much thermal mass. Bar and plate construction has a higher fin density and a greater mass so it acts like a heat sink and soaks up heat more efficiently at lower air speeds, releasing it to the air stream once air speed increases. They weigh more but are better at exchanging heat, especially in a water-to-air setup like ours.
Our car is no different than any other that uses this type of setup. The numbers and math are there any thousands of articles relating to the efficiency of a larger heat exchanger. Its not just marketing hype to sell a product. Water-to-air heat exchangers are so good, some people have seen more than 100% increase in cooling efficiency when used with ice in drag racing.
Thank you for the advice. I am going to PM you with a few questions I have if you dont mind.
08-02-2007, 03:47 PM
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PS: A little free intellectual property law advice. Treat this design as proprietary and YOUR property. Mark your blueprints/plans with "Confidential" and "Copyright 2007 - Joe Blow, all rights reserve." This may allow you to sell out the design to a tuner rather than selling the tuner ONE HE and having the tuner copy it.
Seriously, no one is going to patent anything here.
08-02-2007, 03:53 PM
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I received approval from the person I bought it from. This is on top of the fact that the design is changing as well. As the former owner put it, he is the grandfather of the project
08-02-2007, 04:54 PM
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PS: For the right price, I might buy it without supporting data; but with supporting data showing tangible improvement, I'd absolutely buy it.
Last edited by Fifth Ring; 08-02-2007 at 05:41 PM.
08-02-2007, 04:56 PM
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I'll take one...as sson as there available. I did this some time ago on a 1989 celica all-trac. It was a turbocharged, ait to water setup. upgrading the heat exchanger, allowed lower temps and also allwed me to dial in some more boost. One of the best mods you can do.
08-03-2007, 07:07 AM
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There will be some data for sure. But there is no need to go crazy trying to prove to people that a larger heat exchanger works better than the stock unit. I think comparing this to a K&N filter is a little bit unfair.
The stock unit is a tube and fin design with plastic end tanks. The prototype is tube and fin as well. But the production unit will be bar and plate. Tube and fin intercoolers are light and good at exchanging heat, they don't have as much thermal mass. Bar and plate construction has a higher fin density and a greater mass so it acts like a heat sink and soaks up heat more efficiently at lower air speeds, releasing it to the air stream once air speed increases. They weigh more but are better at exchanging heat, especially in a water-to-air setup like ours.
Our car is no different than any other that uses this type of setup. The numbers and math are there any thousands of articles relating to the efficiency of a larger heat exchanger. Its not just marketing hype to sell a product. Water-to-air heat exchangers are so good, some people have seen more than 100% increase in cooling efficiency when used with ice in drag racing.
Thank you for the advice. I am going to PM you with a few questions I have if you dont mind.
The stock unit is a tube and fin design with plastic end tanks. The prototype is tube and fin as well. But the production unit will be bar and plate. Tube and fin intercoolers are light and good at exchanging heat, they don't have as much thermal mass. Bar and plate construction has a higher fin density and a greater mass so it acts like a heat sink and soaks up heat more efficiently at lower air speeds, releasing it to the air stream once air speed increases. They weigh more but are better at exchanging heat, especially in a water-to-air setup like ours.
Our car is no different than any other that uses this type of setup. The numbers and math are there any thousands of articles relating to the efficiency of a larger heat exchanger. Its not just marketing hype to sell a product. Water-to-air heat exchangers are so good, some people have seen more than 100% increase in cooling efficiency when used with ice in drag racing.
Thank you for the advice. I am going to PM you with a few questions I have if you dont mind.
GREAT project and INFO
See yeah
