dkflipse's C32 on Mustang Dyno w/19" wheels: 352RWHP & 361RWTQ!

[neihouma]

I'm still pondering how in the world he's making so much RWHP & RWTQ on 19" wheels. As of right now I'm bald ripping my hair out and watching black hair turn white. My hats off to you Donn As FAR as I know, he has a Renntech Stage 1, SL55 intake, SL55 splitter, Johnson Pump, and Code3's heat exchanger: Correct me if I'm wrong Donn Well here's the pudding ya'll been waiting for: Also take NOTE that everytime you RUN your car, it gets better and BETTER And the actual graphs, pretty damn good AFR: Kudos to you Renntech! And Donn, your C32 is making 18.5PSI (33psi - 14.5psi = 18.5psi): And your IAT's: (Mine are lower than yours BTW ) Soon I'll start a thread of MY C32, and a LET vs CODE3 IAT on the dyno

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[dkflipse]

And your IAT's: (Mine are lower than yours BTW )

You're cooler than I am!

Thanks for posting the pics. I've been trying to figure out hot to do it for the past 2 hours!

[neihouma]

Originally Posted by dkflipse

Thanks for posting the pics. I've been trying to figure out hot to do it for the past 2 hours!

No problem. I gotta send you the full package, pics of the car, videos, datalogs, etc..etc..

[SteveL]

This car is running great. Very nice A/F. I'm struggling with a A/F fuel problem on my SLK32. I think the fuel pump is the weak point. SLK32s run out of fuel system capacity at about 350 hp. C32s don't seem to have this problem. SLKs have slightly larger injectors and use an external fuel pump. The C32s use a fuel pump that is in the gas tank.

[Zeppelin]

At 6000rpm my car makes 50 more horsepower than yours

[splinter]

Originally Posted by SteveL

...I think the fuel pump is the weak point...

IIRC, you and I have previously discussed your potential fuel delivery situation. Have you read its pressure at the rail during WOT runs/tests? Only reason I ask is because the external pump is so easily upgraded. The C contingent is SOL without a substantial expenditure.

http://www.weldonracing.com/index.phtml

If you do indeed have sufficient volume and its commensurate pressure, then perhaps it’s a DME tuning opportunity that is next on the agenda.

[1FASTC32]

Originally Posted by SteveL

This car is running great. Very nice A/F. I'm struggling with a A/F fuel problem on my SLK32. I think the fuel pump is the weak point. SLK32s run out of fuel system capacity at about 350 hp. C32s don't seem to have this problem. SLKs have slightly larger injectors and use an external fuel pump. The C32s use a fuel pump that is in the gas tank.

steve, i don't think it is the pump or injectors, i have a steady 55 pounds all the way to redline...i think it is a tuning issue...do you have a wideband O2 on the car?

you can watch the car go from 12:1 A/F to 15:1 A/F in an instant right at 1.4 bar of boost...just food for thought...i am working on the tuning issue

[c32used]

Nice numbers now track it!

[Kirby]

dkflipse, what kind of wheels are those?

[SteveL]

Originally Posted by 1FASTC32

steve, i don't think it is the pump or injectors, i have a steady 55 pounds all the way to redline...i think it is a tuning issue...do you have a wideband O2 on the car?

you can watch the car go from 12:1 A/F to 15:1 A/F in an instant right at 1.4 bar of boost...just food for thought...i am working on the tuning issue

In looking at the graphs above more closely, why are the top graphs showing 15:1 and the bottom showing a good 12.x to 1?

The reason why I think it is a pump or injector problem is that after I had my headers made, the car leaned out. I had it reprogrammed to add 10% more fuel through the entire RPM range. It worked at the lower RPMs but at 4500 rpm and higher, adding more fuel didn't have any impact on the A/F. The car ran the same as it did before the reprogram. I don't have a wideband O2 on the car. All of the A/F data was captured using a tailpipe sensor on a dyno. I haven't seen anything near 15 to 1 using the tailpipe sensor. I'll email you the before and after program data. Maybe you are right and it is a tuning issue. I hope it is.

[1FASTC32]

Originally Posted by SteveL

In looking at the graphs above more closely, why are the top graphs showing 15:1 and the bottom showing a good 12.x to 1?

The reason why I think it is a pump or injector problem is that after I had my headers made, the car leaned out. I had it reprogrammed to add 10% more fuel through the entire RPM range. It worked at the lower RPMs but at 4500 rpm and higher, adding more fuel didn't have any impact on the A/F. The car ran the same as it did before the reprogram. I don't have a wideband O2 on the car. All of the A/F data was captured using a tailpipe sensor on a dyno. I haven't seen anything near 15 to 1 using the tailpipe sensor. I'll email you the before and after program data. Maybe you are right and it is a tuning issue. I hope it is.

shoot me an email, i would like to see the data...they added 15% fuel to my car, no change either...i think they are tuning the wrong part of the graph...either that, or we really are running out of fuel...either way, i am going to get it figured out before i put the twin turbos on...did Renntech do the tuning on the dyno?

[AMG-Driver]

Originally Posted by SteveL

This car is running great. Very nice A/F. I'm struggling with a A/F fuel problem on my SLK32. I think the fuel pump is the weak point. SLK32s run out of fuel system capacity at about 350 hp. C32s don't seem to have this problem. SLKs have slightly larger injectors and use an external fuel pump. The C32s use a fuel pump that is in the gas tank.

Hello Steve,

you could be right. When they made the official increase of the speed-limit up to 280 KM/H at AMG in Affalterbach/Germany on my SLK32, they also changed the fuel pump into a bigger one. They said it is neccessary because the normal fuel pump is at its limit, especially when you drive faster than 250 KM/H for a longer period. When you rise the speed-limit of a C32 at AMG/Germany, you don't have to change the fuel pump. The C32 has, as you said, a different fuel pump.

Hope that helps.
Kind Regards from Germany
Bruno

[SteveL]

Originally Posted by AMG-Driver

Hello Steve,

you could be right. When they made the official increase of the speed-limit up to 280 KM/H at AMG in Affalterbach/Germany on my SLK32, they also changed the fuel pump into a bigger one. They said it is neccessary because the normal fuel pump is at its limit, especially when you drive faster than 250 KM/H for a longer period. When you rise the speed-limit of a C32 at AMG/Germany, you don't have to change the fuel pump. The C32 has, as you said, a different fuel pump.

Hope that helps.
Kind Regards from Germany
Bruno

Bruno, thanks for the confirmation. I remember seeing this information way back with SLK32s came out but couldn't find it. This definitely helps me think I am on the right track.

[AdamG@NorCal]

Originally Posted by SteveL

In looking at the graphs above more closely, why are the top graphs showing 15:1 and the bottom showing a good 12.x to 1?

The reason why I think it is a pump or injector problem is that after I had my headers made, the car leaned out. I had it reprogrammed to add 10% more fuel through the entire RPM range. It worked at the lower RPMs but at 4500 rpm and higher, adding more fuel didn't have any impact on the A/F. The car ran the same as it did before the reprogram. I don't have a wideband O2 on the car. All of the A/F data was captured using a tailpipe sensor on a dyno. I haven't seen anything near 15 to 1 using the tailpipe sensor. I'll email you the before and after program data. Maybe you are right and it is a tuning issue. I hope it is.

I don't think it's a tuning issue. You should have Ken check out the values of the fuel pressure to SEE if the pressure is falling (below normal). Also please email me the dyno charts.

[SteveL]

Originally Posted by 1FASTC32

shoot me an email, i would like to see the data...they added 15% fuel to my car, no change either...i think they are tuning the wrong part of the graph...either that, or we really are running out of fuel...either way, i am going to get it figured out before i put the twin turbos on...did Renntech do the tuning on the dyno?

Erick, based on the 450cc injectors that are in the SLK, Chris did the calculations and for the hp we are tying to produce, we are getting close to the limit of the injectors. On the C32, the injectors are a little smaller I think so C32 could be having issues because of the injectors and SLK32 because of the fuel pumps or it may just be the entire fuel system. I'm going to start but upgrading the pump but if I want to go to a larger pulley, I think the injectors could be the next weak point on SLKs. If the injectors are really smaller on the C32, then they could be the weak point on the C32.

[1FASTC32]

Originally Posted by SteveL

Erick, based on the 450cc injectors that are in the SLK, Chris did the calculations and for the hp we are tying to produce, we are getting close to the limit of the injectors. On the C32, the injectors are a little smaller I think so C32 could be having issues because of the injectors and SLK32 because of the fuel pumps or it may just be the entire fuel system. I'm going to start but upgrading the pump but if I want to go to a larger pulley, I think the injectors could be the next weak point on SLKs. If the injectors are really smaller on the C32, then they could be the weak point on the C32.

Steve, you are exactly right... don't know why i did not do the injector calculation before now, but i am out of injector right now...

sorry for complaining about the tuning Adam, my mistake...

[dkflipse]

Fellas - go find you're own thread

[neihouma]

Originally Posted by dkflipse

Fellas - go find you're own thread

It's your own thread

[dkflipse]

What the hell you doing up so early -

[moosejaw]

I gotta work today and tom. And I dont work at Starbucks

[neihouma]

Originally Posted by dkflipse

What the hell you doing up so early -

Rude awakening this morning

Originally Posted by moosejaw

I gotta work today and tom. And I dont work at Starbucks

Sorry to hear, but I get to close 5 days out of the year, and
you damn could bet it's the holidays.

[moosejaw]

Originally Posted by neihouma

and
you damn could bet it's the holidays.

you are teling me
most places that have 80 degree weather on Jesus' birthday is usually a tropical island, resort, or cruise ship. Not in this third world country we know as the banana republic

[Guran]

Originally Posted by SteveL

Erick, based on the 450cc injectors that are in the SLK, Chris did the calculations and for the hp we are tying to produce, we are getting close to the limit of the injectors. On the C32, the injectors are a little smaller I think so C32 could be having issues because of the injectors and SLK32 because of the fuel pumps or it may just be the entire fuel system. I'm going to start but upgrading the pump but if I want to go to a larger pulley, I think the injectors could be the next weak point on SLKs. If the injectors are really smaller on the C32, then they could be the weak point on the C32.

CrossFireForum :

"I finally got the specs on the SRT6 injectors from my SPY at Bosch I must say, they have a HUGE flow difference from the NA engine and now I have to figure out how the SC engine is regulating the flow, whether by pulse width or pressure regulator.

NA ENGINE: 17 lbs/hr at 3.8 Bar, or 55 psi/ 14.5 ohms.
SC ENGINE: 51.6 lbs/hr @ 55.1 PSI / 14.5 Ohms based on 380 kPA = 3.8 bars = 55.1 PSI "

[Guran]

Originally Posted by Guran

CrossFireForum :

"I finally got the specs on the SRT6 injectors from my SPY at Bosch I must say, they have a HUGE flow difference from the NA engine and now I have to figure out how the SC engine is regulating the flow, whether by pulse width or pressure regulator.

NA ENGINE: 17 lbs/hr at 3.8 Bar, or 55 psi/ 14.5 ohms.
SC ENGINE: 51.6 lbs/hr @ 55.1 PSI / 14.5 Ohms based on 380 kPA = 3.8 bars = 55.1 PSI "

51,6 lbs/hr * 55,1 psi = 541,8cc ???? 450 cc ?

[SteveL]

Originally Posted by Guran

51,6 lbs/hr * 55,1 psi = 541,8cc ???? 450 cc ?

A guy on the r170 forum had his injectors flow tested and reported that they are 450cc. He is having them enlarged.

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/r170...rojects-5.html

And well not really relevant to the C32, here is a link to a new thread more more details on the SLK32 fuel system.

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/r170...-projects.html